Terry Dodge Posted November 8, 2010 Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 How long is the leader? What line is best used for the leader? I can't seem to find anything on youtube that shows using this techniques in small rivers or streams. I'm guessing I want to find what I think is a good wintering hole and cast the F&F up stream of the hole letting it drift down through the hole keeping my line tight and every now and then shaking the hell out of the tip of the longest rod I have. Does this sound about right? Will and bobber/float do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm M Posted November 8, 2010 Report Share Posted November 8, 2010 take a old thin wood stick float replace the spring with silicone tube. use the chenille/marabou crappie jigs, small tube jigs or even pinkie jigs. i use the same rod/reel line i do for everything else. generally want it off the bottom so let water depth and fish determine how much line below the float. sacreligious to the f-n-f faithful but it's cheap, you ain't afraid to toss it into anything and it works. if you dig creating your own stuff and catching fish on it , cool. it's not necessary but it's always a groove to catch on your own creation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 10, 2010 Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 Terry- leader? 8 lbs mono works fine. 1" weighted float. This stuff may help: FNF Location Theories My Float and Fly Approach Super cold smallies 41 Float and Fly fishing reports Float often needs to be near the bottom as fish will sometimes lay right on the bottom. You want the fly to tick over rocks and take the eye of fish in laying in divits too. Play around with depth and shake cadence until you get bit. The hardest part is finding the pod. Then your own personal confidence. Then patience. If you follow a process, you can be very successfull all winter. Last, the guy that has caught more FnF bass than even myself: Creek style Float and Fly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Gillio Posted November 10, 2010 Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 Terry,also be sure the fly or jig is hanging horizontally from the line. It makes a world of difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rich mc Posted November 10, 2010 Report Share Posted November 10, 2010 anybody use any scent on the fly? rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 anybody use any scent on the fly? rich I don't need scent. Gimmick. Liable to turn your fly into frozen wax. I've hit 'em in 33F water, both myself and MD have sampled enough with and without. It is all about location, depth, and cadence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm M Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 I don't need scent. Gimmick. Liable to turn your fly into frozen wax. I've hit 'em in 33F water, both myself and MD have sampled enough with and without. It is all about location, depth, and cadence. proper depth and speed control in the proper location is what it's about no matter the technique. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asherman Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 Float N Fly fishing is pretty simple. Any fixed float that suspends the jig will work. I have Power Pro line on most of my spinning rods, so I use an eight to ten feet leader of 8 pound test fluorocarbon leader at the end of my line. Mono would work just as well. A longer rod works better than a shorter rod, because the longer rod makes it easier to keep the line off of the water which means better control of the float and the jig. Last year I pulled the cobwebs off of my old nine foot noodle rod and it worked well. Some of the best results that I have had with the Float N Fly have occurred when I found deep pools or eddies where I could keep the float/jig stationary and twitch it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 So float & fly technique was discussed at the Chicago region meeting lastnight (11/13) for just a few miutes and from what I understand nobody uses a 3 way swivel when using this technique? Has anyone tried the f & f with the 3 way swivel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted November 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Uuh, that would be float-n-three-way swivel-n-leader-n-fly. Okay, what kind of jig flies are people using? Anybody ever try rich's Ultimate Worm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Don R Posted November 14, 2010 Report Share Posted November 14, 2010 Craft hair and bucktail are night and day different in composition and movement in the water. If you are doing float n fly jigs, you really should get ahold of some craft hair. Deer hair is much too stiff. Craft hair upon getting wet just fluffs in the water and the tiny fibers are constantly moving ever so slightly. It is these fine movements when drifted by a winter smallie that rings their dinner bell. You can order through fly shops or through www.punisherlures.com. It is not very expensive and a couple of colors will allow you tye plenty. About the only other hair that I have found works almost as good as craft hair is Arctic Fox tail. Now when it comes to jigheads, the big key is you need a jighead that will allow the whole fly to sit horizontally in the water under the float. The "minnow head" jig works great with its 90 degree angle hook-eye. Of course, we pour our own, but you can find jigheads just like ours on the net. I like to fish with a jig no heavier than 1/16 oz. Many times I fish with ones lighter than that. Any other questions..........just holler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted November 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2010 Got out today after work for about an hour and gave this F & F thing a shot and FAILD. Oh well, I'll try again this weekend. Man it gets dark early! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm M Posted November 17, 2010 Report Share Posted November 17, 2010 Terry, It's just one of the techniques that work for colder water, it's never been one of my first choices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 17, 2010 Report Share Posted November 17, 2010 Terry- You might be best served to pay less attention to lake smallie FnF articles. They won't help you find fish in a river and can be downright confusing for a river angler who isn't fishing in 5' of water let alone 50'. All you need is a 1" weighted float, 1/16th oz fly, and a game plan. Location is critical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted November 17, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2010 I've got two of the three. I always think I have a game plan but at the end of the day I always end up feeling like Wade Philips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 18, 2010 Report Share Posted November 18, 2010 Game Plan: 1) Start with an area that you always catch a nice concentration of bass in in the summer. Do you always fish that area in low water or do you catch fish with the water up? Way up? If you have caught fish with the water steaming high, then you already understand fish will move to rest areas. Banks, eddies, laydowns that block current. This will give you an idea that faster water moves fish to slower water. Now add cold. Where do those fish survive? Look around you. Think like a fish. A cold fish that needs to conserve energy or die. 2) Cold water will slow down metabolism of all the fishes in the river. They start to vacate the shallow runs and riffles in the Fall. It no longer is profitable on an energy input/ouput basis to be in those areas. Consequently, you can waste a lot of time where there are no fish. This no time to try new spots. Since bass are have less energy to spend, they'll seek areas where they are sheltered from overhead view. Bass will seek areas they will stand a good chance of surviving if the river rises 10'. They need to have a contingency plan or they die. 3) A shallow choke point that opens to a wide pool with slack usually to one side. The current flows to one side regardless of water amounts. Deep bends with slow water areas created by points, laydowns, bolders, creek inlets, large, wide pools with cover. 4) A quick way with the water low and cooling is to float down the river with polarized glasses and spot the rough fish schools. Smallies will be near the same places in winter. Or, if all you are seeing is emptiness (quite common) fish the deeper areas where you cannot see the bottom. If these areas also have shelter from high water, you have likely found a spot. 5) Usually if there are bass active, they will strike within minutes. Once you know there are bass in a spot you gain confidence. Confidence and patience are key. Once you get the first couple it will lead to more. Watching the float dunk is addictive! 6) Occasionally, bass are literally sitting on the bottom motionless (often very cold, clear, sunny). The fly doesn't work then unless it is on the bottom. 7) Best conditions- when the water isn't frozen. Green stain 18-24" vis with some sunlight, or storm front coming is often better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronk Posted November 18, 2010 Report Share Posted November 18, 2010 Re smb winter movement a guide on the Muskegon told me that the smb vacate the river entirely in winter spending it in Muskegon Lake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 18, 2010 Report Share Posted November 18, 2010 Re smb winter movement a guide on the Muskegon told me that the smb vacate the river entirely in winter spending it in Muskegon Lake. Makes sense they would move down. That one big, slack pool. Would they pass up great winter habitat to move to the lake? Who knows. Worth the research dollarsat some point? Would think the turnover or kill rate would be reduced living in the lake vs river. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 19, 2010 Report Share Posted November 19, 2010 Brenden Thanks for putting so much info together in one place. There was nothing out about cold water fishing years ago. Phil f Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 21, 2010 Report Share Posted November 21, 2010 Brenden Thanks for putting so much info together in one place. There was nothing out about cold water fishing years ago. Phil f No problem. I enjoy seeing other's success almost as much as hooking my own. Now if only I get my lazy butt out and fish this weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted November 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2010 Well I FAILED again. Got out around 12:30 and did the float and fly thing for three hours until 3:30. Nothing. Tried the float at different levels giving a couple twitches about every four seconds. I guess my next plan will be to stop being so stubborn and see if I can't get some craft hair at Gander Mtn. and start tying up some flies like Mr. Graham uses. I find it hard to believe that it will make that big of a difference but like I said "I'm stubborn." Will give it a shot next weekend on Bronze Friday and maybe then I'll be able to make a post under the "Smallmouth Reports". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonn Graham Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 YOu won't find craft hair at Gander. Best craft hair on the market comes from punisher lures down at Dale Hollow. www.punisherlures.com Most colors and best price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 With such low water and slow currents a jerkbait, fluke or light weight tube might be more effective than a float n fly. A lot of fish are scattered in shallow water. I always go with a tube and than a float n fly. Catching fish out of less than 2 foot of water lately. Also once fish are located on another bait switch to a float n fly to get the feel of it. Getting that first bite can seem impossible but just keep at it. I always feel that cold water fishing gets easier as the water comes up, it concentrates the forcing them into smaller areas with less current. Philf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bterrill Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 With such low water and slow currents a jerkbait, fluke or light weight tube might be more effective than a float n fly. A lot of fish are scattered in shallow water. I always go with a tube and than a float n fly. Catching fish out of less than 2 foot of water lately. Also once fish are located on another bait switch to a float n fly to get the feel of it. Getting that first bite can seem impossible but just keep at it. I always feel that cold water fishing gets easier as the water comes up, it concentrates the forcing them into smaller areas with less current. Philf Agree completely. FNF works better when there is some flow. No flow means the fish are anywhere. I haven't caught a fish on float and fly yet this year. We don't have any water, so they are incredibly hard to locate even in a pool you know are there. Jerkbaits, swimbait, and shakey worm today wish I would have went with the shakey worm in the early pool. Dull hooks are a crime on a jerkbait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Dodge Posted March 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 I'm thinking this Float & Fly technique doesn't work all that well on the Kish or Kilbuck. Struck-out again. Nothing to dance about, that's for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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