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The Bane of My Existence


gordon p
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Last year on the trip I took with Paul T. he said: "death before mono" . I think I now ( after 40 years + of fishing ) heartily agree. I have used both mono ( duh, of course ) and "superbraids" over the years, the braids mostly for baitcasting, and this year I wanted to experiment with different mono's to see if I could find one that didn't eventually end up a birds-nest. Tried Yo-Zuri Hybrid-- Nope. P-Line , Nope. Bought some Suffix Braid ( plugged by Larry Dahlberg as good for spincasting as well ) YESSSSSSS!! Works great for spinning, casts a bloody mile, no twist !!! Great Googly Moogly!!

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Last year on the trip I took with Paul T. he said: "death before mono" . I think I now ( after 40 years + of fishing ) heartily agree. I have used both mono ( duh, of course ) and "superbraids" over the years, the braids mostly for baitcasting, and this year I wanted to experiment with different mono's to see if I could find one that didn't eventually end up a birds-nest. Tried Yo-Zuri Hybrid-- Nope. P-Line , Nope. Bought some Suffix Braid ( plugged by Larry Dahlberg as good for spincasting as well ) YESSSSSSS!! Works great for spinning, casts a bloody mile, no twist !!! Great Googly Moogly!!

I, of course, meant spinning and not "spincasting" Got your Abu-Garcia 170 ??

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I like Suffix too.

But...Line twist has nothing to do with the type of line. Line twist is caused by some mechanical force actually twisting the line, like improper line installtion or the lure physically twisting.

Mono doesn't twist by itself and it should not bird nest without being twisted. Braids and fused lines are less suceptable to the effects of twisting (like bird nests and those annoying loops). I believe this is because they are smaller diameter and much more limp.

Might want to take a look at what is causing the line twist as even though it seems like a miracle cure, Suffix can bird nest too.

Might save you an annoying day when you discover that.

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There are monos and braids. And then there are the other lines. I admit that I have not tried Suffix. But i wonder if it tends to catch and knot like the braids I have tried.

 

The other lines? Those would be stranded like Fire Line. I still like how this one absorbs twisting; and, when a tangle comes, loops and knots slide out with light pressure. Though Fireline has it faults, it still gives me more fishing time because I spend less time picking out tangles. Right now I like it because I know what to expect when I use it.

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I have started using Seaguar Florocarbon Line down here because of the super clear conditions on Table Rock Lake. It has improved my success tremendously. I picked up 12 Smallies on a very tough day yesterday and 6 of those were over the 15" size limit. If you have clear water try some Seaguar Florocarbon it is good on Spinning or Baitcasting.

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I second what Gary said about Seaguar. I've used the Invisix and its limpness and castability are great.

 

In terms of line twist- I have never had a problem with it. I manually close my bail and put on my own line. I'm doing something right. Good fishing

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I second what Gary said about Seaguar. I've used the Invisix and its limpness and castability are great.

 

In terms of line twist- I have never had a problem with it. I manually close my bail and put on my own line. I'm doing something right. Good fishing

 

 

Gary-Paul we are talking filling a spinning reel up with it not a leader...right? It doesn't leap off the spool?

 

Great Googly Moogly is right!

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I like Suffix too.

But...Line twist has nothing to do with the type of line. Line twist is caused by some mechanical force actually twisting the line, like improper line installtion or the lure physically twisting.

Mono doesn't twist by itself and it should not bird nest without being twisted. Braids and fused lines are less suceptable to the effects of twisting (like bird nests and those annoying loops). I believe this is because they are smaller diameter and much more limp.

Might want to take a look at what is causing the line twist as even though it seems like a miracle cure, Suffix can bird nest too.

Might save you an annoying day when you discover that.

Point taken, I agree with your assessment about braids. No problems with the Suffix so far. Even though mono "doesn't twist by itself" I think the dark forces of the universe are in collusion here!!

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There are monos and braids. And then there are the other lines. I admit that I have not tried Suffix. But i wonder if it tends to catch and knot like the braids I have tried.

 

The other lines? Those would be stranded like Fire Line. I still like how this one absorbs twisting; and, when a tangle comes, loops and knots slide out with light pressure. Though Fireline has it faults, it still gives me more fishing time because I spend less time picking out tangles. Right now I like it because I know what to expect when I use it.

Got mixed feelings about it as well--I don't like the way it packs on the spool.

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I knew bass players were a bit slow.....

Slow ? Why I can run the mile in under uh, 30 minutes ? And Mr. Smarty Pants, try playing one of yer rootin-tootin, horny horn solos without a bass player and see if anyone dances !!!!!!!!!!!!! :P

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Just the act of casting and retrieving with a spinning reel, ALL spinning reels puts twist in line. Look at how the line comes off the spool when you cast and how it is put back on when retrieving. Ever use a garden hose? Or an extension cord? Take a coiled extension cord, lay it on the ground and then pull one end away. Now pick up the remainder of the cord and wind the wire back on and see how the wire becomes twisted. A spinning reel works the same way. Mono has more resistance to being twisted than superlines do so it shows the ill effects sooner with the same amount of twist.

An easy way to get rid of line twist especially in a river, is to cut off your lure and let the current take out your line at least the length of a full cast. Reel the line back in pinching the line between your fingers as you reel.

 

A baitcaster takes line off and puts it back on exactly the same way so line twist only becomes an issue if you have lures that spin.

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I have started using Seaguar Florocarbon Line down here because of the super clear conditions on Table Rock Lake.

 

I'm mainly a fireline user but the above situation is the 1 area where a flourocarbon could and has outfished a superline or braided line. The super clear high pressured lake or quarry will have some line shy bass. In river conditions I've never seen it make a difference for anythng other than trout. In the crystal clear lakes of Sylvania I haven't seen it make a difference. This is with many hours of field testing with a mono user in the same canoe. I think the superlines ability to cast a long distance to fish that haven't seen you yet, outweigh the fishes ability to see the line. You can always go with a flourocarbon leader if you are getting out fished badly by a mono user.

 

The line twist thing also seems to be more of a factor in river fishing than lake fishing. As Gordon said there are just more dark forces at play. Fireline is a solid overall line that is very resistant to twisting and backlashing. The other superline that I have used and would recommend is powerpro. Both are expensive, loose their coating and will need to be reversed on the spool after extended use. I am still attending the school of "death before mono" with the rare exception of a flourocarbon leader. The benefits significantly outweigh the downsided in my book.

 

When making the transition from mono to superlines there are a few other things to consider.

#1 Learn the polymar knot because most other knots will slip.

#2 You will still need a mono backing on your spool or the whole spool will slip.

#3 You will want to use rods with premium guides or the superlines will wear grooves in the eyes of your rods. The ceramic fuji guides work well.

#4 I like to fish rods with a softer action tip because the line doesn't give and your rod will need to. This is more important when fishing presentations like spinnerbaits and cranks on a tight line. Something has to give a little for the lure to get sucked into the fishes mouth. The superline isn't giving an inch so the rod tip needs to.

 

 

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Just the act of casting and retrieving with a spinning reel, ALL spinning reels puts twist in line. Look at how the line comes off the spool when you cast and how it is put back on when retrieving. Ever use a garden hose? Or an extension cord? Take a coiled extension cord, lay it on the ground and then pull one end away. Now pick up the remainder of the cord and wind the wire back on and see how the wire becomes twisted. A spinning reel works the same way. Mono has more resistance to being twisted than superlines do so it shows the ill effects sooner with the same amount of twist.

An easy way to get rid of line twist especially in a river, is to cut off your lure and let the current take out your line at least the length of a full cast. Reel the line back in pinching the line between your fingers as you reel.

 

A baitcaster takes line off and puts it back on exactly the same way so line twist only becomes an issue if you have lures that spin.

I do that............................

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I used to be a die-hard mono/copolymer guy. The last two years has seen me basically go with all braid. I have tried Cortland, Fireline, and Power Pro, but prefer Suffix hands down! Couple more things about braid that I have figured out:

 

While the palamar knot is the best knot to use with any line, the improved clinch knot will not slip with braid.

 

Most of today's rods have good enough guides that will not groove with superlines. Many of the guides that grooved were early on in the superline era.

 

Mono backing works great under the superline, but also wrapping your spool with one layer of electrical tape works just as well.

 

Suffix does not lose its inherent color like other braids on the market (In addition, Suffix has a rebate offer going on right now..............I know, I know, I sound like a commercial, but when I like a product I like to sing the praises of that product).

 

Braid gives you far less headaches on a spinning reel than mono or copolymer. I found this out first-hand while guiding newcomers fishing with spinning reels. I started using McCoy copolymer on all my clients reels. What a disaster! While I had no problem controlling copolymer on my spinning reels, my clients with very limited experience had a different experience. I was respooling reels at least once a day along the river. Decided to try braid on the clients' reels and have never looked back. Matter of fact, that is what caused me to switch over to braid.

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I'm just the stubborn type that will probably carry Trilene XT with me to my grave.

The improved clinch works for me, save for maybe 2-3 times an entire season, which speaks to other mistakes in the process anyway.

Unless of course it is Stren- which has come loose every time I spooled it.

I now run from the mere presence of that stuff.

 

I have favored braid for anything but crankbaits in the past....just can't seem to shake the XT stubbornness.

Paul brings up a great point, so maybe that's why I favor a heavy rod, almost always.

Different strokes, as they say......

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Slow ? Why I can run the mile in under uh, 30 minutes ? And Mr. Smarty Pants, try playing one of yer rootin-tootin, horny horn solos without a bass player and see if anyone dances !!!!!!!!!!!!! :P

 

What unmittigated audacity!

 

Gordon you should pick up some deadly yellow snow and rub all into his beady little eyes with vigorous circular motion hither to unknown to the people on this board but destined to take the place of the mud shark in their mythology.

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I'm a fan of Masterbraid!!! Have a couple reels with PowerPro and I cant say that I care for it very much. It's good but not that good. Got some T.U.F Line XP, too and other than the color of it, I can't tell the difference between it and MB. Now when it comes to Sufix braid....I held off on trying it because of some bad reviews on either Cabela's or BPS sites. But I'd be open to trying it sometime in the future if you guys like it.

 

I use hi-vis mono for crappie fishing. I've got some Endurance supermono on my crappie setups. Good stuff. Super limp and thin. 6# feels more like 4#.

 

I love my braided lines for bass and don't see going back. I am considering going to hi-vis coloring as I am finding myself to be a linewatcher.

Hi-vis braid with a flourocarbon or mono leader...Anyone got any thoughts on that???

 

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I'm a fan of Masterbraid!!! Have a couple reels with PowerPro and I cant say that I care for it very much. It's good but not that good. Got some T.U.F Line XP, too and other than the color of it, I can't tell the difference between it and MB. Now when it comes to Sufix braid....I held off on trying it because of some bad reviews on either Cabela's or BPS sites. But I'd be open to trying it sometime in the future if you guys like it.

 

I use hi-vis mono for crappie fishing. I've got some Endurance supermono on my crappie setups. Good stuff. Super limp and thin. 6# feels more like 4#.

 

I love my braided lines for bass and don't see going back. I am considering going to hi-vis coloring as I am finding myself to be a linewatcher.

Hi-vis braid with a flourocarbon or mono leader...Anyone got any thoughts on that???

 

No leader needed with braid- if yellow- color the last ten feet with green sharpie if you feel you need to. My buddy caught crystal clear winter fish on float and fly in river on 20 lb PP.

 

 

BTW, I like the limpness when the coating wears off PP, that's when it becomes a superior line. I sometimes go a couple of outings without tying a knot.

 

Watch that your hook doesn't have an opening in the eye, you line can and will slip through.

 

When using topwaters like Spooks, Sammy's, Poppers and even flukes. Slack line lures. Check your spool for loose line before snapping off a hard cast that's how backlashes happen. When I use tight line lures like cranks, spinnerbaits, buzzbaits, tubes I never have backlashes. In other words- loose line on spool= bad with hard cast.

 

 

 

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I'm sticking with the mono. I'm using suffix elite it's pretty good. I like to throw a long cast and really tangle it up and just cut the line. With mono it's only a few bucks with the braid it's a little more. I like the stretch on mono when you hook a big fish real close, maybe it's a little more forgiving.

Phil

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