A Fly Rod Float-n-Fly system

[Tom L]

First of all, I would like to thanks John, Eric, and those ISA members that have been sharing information on the Float-n-Fly system and posting the success and effectiveness of the system for stream smallmouth fishing in cold water.

 

As a fly rod aficionado, I love to catch all things that swim with a fly rod. But when the winter approaches, my traditional fly rod setup becomes ineffective in cold water streams. So I would normally hang up my smallmouth fly rod, wait until spring, or turn my attention to other fish species such as Steelhead.

 

While I was reading John’s Float-n-Fly article (posted by Eric) and he mentioned that he preferred an 8 ½ foot spinning rod for his setup, I could not help but thinking to myself that the Float-n-Fly is a lot similar to a fly rod system that I used to drift spawn sacs, tub jigs, and hair jigs for Steelhead back in my Chuck-n-Duck days.

 

So with little knowledge that I have and if I may, I would like to share the fly rod Float-n-Fly system with you. But first, I’d like to point out that this system is not my original. Steelheaders around the Great Lakes have been using it for a long time. I first learned about it was back in the early 1990’s.

 

 

 

 

The Rod, the Reel and the Setup

The fly rod Float-n-Fly system is quite simple. You can use your existing favorite smallmouth fly rod and reel. All you need to do is a slight modification to your fly reel by replacing your existing fly line with a 12lbs monofilament line. You don’t need to take the backing off the reel when you do this. Just attach the monofilament line to your backing and spool the monofilament line onto the fly reel.

 

However, if you have an extra spool for your fly reel, then you can just spool the 12lbs monofilament onto the extra spool and use it on the reel. This way you are always be ready to switch back and forth between a traditional fly reel and a Float-n-Fly reel. It is important that you use a 12lbs monofilament line or a litter bit larger if you want to, but any smaller monofilament line may not work as well.

 

After that you need to attach about 16” of 3x or 2x tippet to the 12lbs monofilament line.

 

The rest is just like the Float-n-Fly as described in John’s article that you attach a craft hair jig (fly) and a 1” bobber (float) to the line.

 

After you are done, you will end up with something similar to this.

 

 

Now you are ready to go fishing.

 

 

 

 

Casting and Presenting the Fly

First, strip some monofilament line off the fly reel (enough to reach the area that you want to place your fly), keep the float about 1-3 feet off the rod tip, and when you’re ready just flip the whole things (Float-n-Fly) out to your target.

 

If you need to recast, all you have to do is striping the Float-n-Fly in and manage the monofilament line with your line-hand or let it piles in front of you, just as you would with a fly line. Do not reel the monofilament line onto the spool. If you need to drift your fly further out, just strip some line off the reel and feed it through the guides.

 

There you have it, a fly rod Float-n-Fly system.

 

Yep! Forget about your double hauls, aerial mends or other fancy fly casts that you are so proud of, you are not going to be able to do any of those with this system. But you will be able to fight a smallie with a fly rod and reel, if you are lucky enough to hook into one.

 

 

 

 

 

 

First Smallmouth Float-n-Fly Outing

I took my newly setup Float-n-Fly fly rod out for a test drive yesterday. I did not catch any smallies, but I hooked into a carp sucker.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I know I still have a lot to learn about winter smallies and their wintering holes. But, it was a good start.

 

 

 

Again thank you for sharing the secrets of the Float-n-Fly. Now I can get out and chase smallie in the winter. I hope you will do too.

 

 

[Ryan Kral]

Really, the float n fly setup is not that different from nymph fishing with an indicator. I like to use a bead head bugger, set to whatever depth I need, under a 3/4" or 1" thingamabobber. Or, just like you would for trout, set up a tandem nymph rig, except I would use a couple buggers, or a bugger/san juan tandem rig, then you can cover different depths.

[Tom L]

Tom that's a common carp and they do like to take down the hair jig! I've noticed they start to feed more aggressively about 1/2 hour before sunset. Fun to catch and some action nonetheless. Happy float-n-fly fishing!

 

Great that you shared your report as it's a good reference for others to learn from.

 

Eric - That was what I thought too. But after looking at it closely, I could not find the barbels.

 

http://www.roughfish.com/content/view/47/128/

[Tom L]

Really, the float n fly setup is not that different from nymph fishing with an indicator. I like to use a bead head bugger, set to whatever depth I need, under a 3/4" or 1" thingamabobber. Or, just like you would for trout, set up a tandem nymph rig, except I would use a couple buggers, or a bugger/san juan tandem rig, then you can cover different depths.

 

Ryan,

Sometimes fishing for trout, steelhead, and smallie, I do exactly as you described, indicator nymphing. For winter steelheading, the traditional indicator nymphing can be very effective at times. But some how for smallie fishing, it works well in the warmer months, but become ineffective in the winter. I'm not sure weather the thick fly line spook them off or something else. Replace the fly line with a monofilament line allow you to be more stealth in your casting and presentation. It also allow you to stay on the bank without get wet. As you already know with fly casting, you need some room for your back cast even for a roll cast, a lot of time you need to wade into position. Wading in winter can be really cold and it may spook the fish too.

 

Maybe that's why I was not able to catch them and that's why I think this setup is better than the traditional setup for winter smallie fishing.

[Norm M]

Tom

 

The whole float n fly thing is nothing new, folks were fishing jigs under bobbers for a long time for a multitude of different species. My earliest memory is fishing for crappies in river backwaters with some of my great uncles while using cane poles when I was a tad.

[jude]

Ryan's mention of the standard trout tandem rig shouldn't go unnoticed. From what I've read, determining the proper depth is a big part of the FnF. Covering two depths at once could really increase the action.

[mannym]

Really, the float n fly setup is not that different from nymph fishing with an indicator. I like to use a bead head bugger, set to whatever depth I need, under a 3/4" or 1" thingamabobber. Or, just like you would for trout, set up a tandem nymph rig, except I would use a couple buggers, or a bugger/san juan tandem rig, then you can cover different depths.

 

 

I was thinking the same,but without the tandem rig.

 

 

I tied some "special" clousers for this rig.

 

Basically, I am using a jig hook with a small silver bead chain for eyes and sparse amounts of white and chartruse maraboo, tied in clouser fashion. I used red thread to make it look injured/bleeding. I added a couple strands of flash and I now have a chilly clouser for a float and fly with my 5 weight.

 

I used indicators when I was fishing for steelhead a few weeks ago. The specific indicator I used kept an egg sucking leach pattern off the bottom. I am hoping it can keep this chilly clouser off the bottom too.

 

The other part I was planning on doing was tying my leaders with a 3 foot butt section of 8 lb mono, followed by 3 feet of 6 lb mono, and 3 feet of 4 lb floro. I figured if I used floro all the way, my indicator would not float. But I wanted to use floro towards the fly end, to make sure the chilly clouser made it down to my desired depth as well as extended so I can see the lite bites on the indicator. I think mono, in any kind of current takes too long to settle and possibly not make the desired depth before the targeted structure or area.

 

 

I am shooting from the hip on this, folks. Anyone want to give me some feedback or improvement ideas?

I will be out Friday on the Vermilion trying this. They are calling for almost 60 in my neck of the woods.

[John Gillio]

Manny, it sounds like a good idea. I wish you luck.

[Tom L]

Tom

 

The whole float n fly thing is nothing new, folks were fishing jigs under bobbers for a long time for a multitude of different species. My earliest memory is fishing for crappies in river backwaters with some of my great uncles while using cane poles when I was a tad.

 

Norm,

It is true that floating a jig, a fly, or a bait under a bobber (float or strike indicator, whatever terms you preffered) is nothing new in fishing. But I think the whole secret of the Float-n-Fly is "the Craft Fur Jig." I was pessimestic at first too, until I tried floating it in my kitchen sink. The craft fur breathes and moves seductively in slow current or no current at all. You cannot duplicate it with other materials, not even marabou or arctic fox fur.

 

Of cause there are other factors that you have to meet too, in order it to work successfully. such as:

 

Horizontal Presentation

The jig has to float horizontally. If you tie your craft fur Clouser styles or streamer styles, it's not going to work as well. That is why it is important that you tie them with crappie jigs or any other jigs that will float the fly horizontally. The clouser styles will work if you tie them with a fly jig hook and that you can find the balance point on the hook. (Manny - Good luck in finding that balance point.)

 

Right Depth

That is when the float come into play. You can adjust it until you find the right depth that would daggling the jig in front, or just above, or just below of the fish.

 

Stealth

It goes without saying "a freighten fish won't eat." It is dificult to achieve this with the traditional floating fly line, even if you use a very long leader. You floating fly line creates shodows and movements that may distract and scare the fish.

 

Location

The fish have to be there.

 

Fish Mood

The fish have to be in the feeding or a marginal feeding moods. I think another reason that the Float-n-Fly works so well in cold water is that the craft fur jig has a power to induce the fish to feed when they are in the marginal feeding mood or even not in the mood at all. We danggle the craft fur jig in front of them until it drives them nut. That is why many success reports said "my float just went side way" or "my float just jiggling".

 

Yes, the Float-n-Fly seems very familiar and simple. But the real secret of it effectiveness is "the Craft Fur Jig". And that is new to most of us.

[Tom L]

Ryan's mention of the standard trout tandem rig shouldn't go unnoticed. From what I've read, determining the proper depth is a big part of the FnF. Covering two depths at once could really increase the action.

 

Jude,

I don't think the tandem flies would work well in this case; because the craft fur jig has to breath/move in an impending way and float horizontally. Adding an add'l fly on the jigt may cause it to lose that balance. But good luck. Give it a try. It may work, who know? Sometimes we need to experiment.

[Guest rich mc]

i think the weighted bobber is a critical step. being able to jiggle the bobber without moving itkeeps it vertical and in place. using a strike indicator will take it off vertical and will cause the fly to move forwardto get under the indicator and out of the zone. may have a chance to fish for a short time tomorrow . rich

[Norm M]

I know I'm in the minority here in that I don't think that specially crafted jigs or specialized floats are the key to the success of the system. The key is that a lure is being presented at the proper depth and at the proper speed to trigger a response from fish. When I use the technique I use an old stick bobber with the spring replaced by a latex tube above a cheap hair jig or one those those chennille/marabou jigs. It catches fish because of proper depth and speed control.

 

I have said it before, it's way groovy to catch fish on lures you have made yourself. I just don't find it necessary to use materials such as craft hair which I have tried and will agree does work. All I am saying is that there are alternatives that are less costly and readily availible to those who wish to try the technique. If you have less than a buck tied up in a rig, you are a lot more likely to fish it into the heavy cover that will hold fish this time of year.

 

Fishing for smallmouth bass in rivers in coldwater isn't really all that new. I contributed to an In Fisherman article on the subject back in 2004. I, like Phil , Josh Mcdermott and a few others in the midwest have been doing it longer than that. That's not to mention the folk out east the Butch Ward inspired, well he inspired me too.

 

 

If you read the latest In Fisherman did on fishing with jigs and floats for steelheading, you will find a strong case for soft plastics as well. Both Phil and I have found them to be effective for coldwater smallmouth as well.

 

Stay versatile in your approach to fishing.

 

 

 

 

Winter topwaters, any one ?

[Jonn Graham]

Will cheap jigs work for the fnf? Sure they will. Do they work better or as good..............that is up for debate. For one thing, I know the type of jigs Norm is talking about. My question would be this concerning those types of jigs...............the hook that is used for those types of jigs is vastly inferior than any type of hook I or Brendan, or anyone else who hand-makes their own fnf jigs. Normally those cheap jigs have "crap" hooks. Sure crap hooks will and do catch fish, but when I hook into a big fish (fnf catches more than just smallmouths), I want a hook that will "stick" without bending or breaking. You will never convince me that the jigs Norm, Jeff, and Phil use are good quality hooks. If you prefer to fish with inferior hooks to save a few bucks...........that is fine with me. I really cannot believe that the price of good fnf jigs would be considered "expensive". I know Norm has tons of baits that are much more expensive than a few good fnf jigs. I also consider Norm, Jeff, and Phil quality anglers that I am sure do not skimp on other pieces of equipment. So the act of skimping on the fnf jigs baffles me, but many things about people baffle me. I don't want to start a pissing war. Fish whatever types of jigs that float your boat, but Please don't compare those $1 or less jigs to the jigs that I make or Brendan make. When it comes to components and craftmanship it is like comparing apples and oranges.

[Ryan Kral]

I'm glad Tom posted this topic, lots of good info here. I'd like to hear back from folks giving there methods of this a try this winter, I might get out over the next couple days to try out some new rigs.

[Norm M]

Jonn

 

The quality of the jigs you or any one else makes was never in question. The point was that it wasn't the materials used in the construction of the rig that lead to success but rather that the rig allowed a lure to be presented at the proper depth and speed that allowed success. If someone utilized a $1.99 jerk bait instead of an expensive Japanesse model at the proper depth/speed they would trigger a response. Who is going to catch more fish, someone who understands current, how fish relate to it and how to make current work for them using an Ugly Stik or a guy who doesn't understand those concepts using custom made gear ?

 

Dick Bergfield [Mr Jig] said it best an ounce of knowledge is better than a pound of gear.

 

As far as the jigs I use for f-n-f, they work for me so far. If I see the need to upgrade, I will as I have in other types of tackle. Truth be told f-n-f is not that high on the list of options for me in coldwater. Yes I know it works, it's just that there are other options I prefer and feel are more suited to how I like to fish.

[Guest]

Speaking of hooks just picked up Some weedless quickset crappie jigs at bass pro 1/16 these look to have a bigger hook on them then most crappie jigs I'll let you guys know how they work. My best winter fishing especially in low water is pretty much full of wood and I can loose a lot of lures. Any suggestions for a relatively inexpensive Jig that I can tie onto or put a tube on? The wide gap helps with hooking and holding fish especially if they get out into current. I've made some big wide gap light jigs by cutting lead off but these are pretty ugly, do work in a pinch. As far as material I've heard duck feathers are good, Craft hair and there was a video from one of the original float n flyers where he was putting "stuff" on the feathers to stiffen them out. I haven't fished enough different materials side by side to say which is best, but there are definitely days when a jig on a float out fishes a jig on the bottom. The fish get focused on minnows? Sometimes the bites are so light you can't feel them on the bottom and a float also makes you slow down. I have to fish more with a jig on the bottom and the float just working as a strike indicator. Great to hear everyone's interested in cold water fishing. Thanks for any info on hooks.

Phil F

[Tom L]

Phil,

Have you tried some of these jigs?

 

http://www.cabelas.c...%3Bcat104544180

 

http://www.cabelas.c...%3Bcat104544180

 

http://www.cabelas.c...%3Bcat104544180

 

I used these on my craft fur jigs. They seems to be very strong and well balanced.

 

http://www.cabelas.c...MAL%3BIK-113503

 

I also used some bucktail hairs tied on the inside of some of my craft fur jigs to make them a little stiffer.

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Didn't see what size hook they had. A # 4 or #2 would probably work. Thanks.

Phil F

[Tom L]

Phil,

 

I have these jigs in 1/32oz and 1/16oz. They are about size #6 and #4 hooks. I hope that helps.

 

http://www.cabelas.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=703575&destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct.jsp%3FparentCategoryId%3D104793480%26categoryId%3D104736780%26subCategoryId%3D104544180%26productId%3D702262%26type%3Dproduct%26destination%3D%252Fcatalog%252Fbrowse%252Ffishing-fishing-jigs-rigs-roundhead-specialty%252F_%252FN-1100354%252FNs-CATEGORY_SEQ_104544180%253FWTz_l%253DSBC%25253BMMcat104793480%25253Bcat104736780%26WTz_l%3DSBC%253BMMcat104793480%253Bcat104736780%253Bcat104544180&WTz_l=YMAL%3BIK-113503

 

 

[mannym]

Rather than post a short boring report, I will just let you guys know in this thread that..... I got the skunk the other day with my jig hook clouser. I tried a few different techniques to no avail. But I did find some rather deep holes ( for this river) One was about 9ft and the other two about 7 and a half. Both with washed up trees on rock shores and light to no current in them. To give you an idea of the layout of this stretch, I traveled upstream about 1.25 miles and only paddled through 3 pools. Average depth was probably in the 3 to 4 foot range with holes as mentioned above. It sure says big old smallies live here. Agree?

 

At the end of the day, I will chalk this one up as a low water recon mission. Normally I fish this stretch for flathead during spring muddy water time. It was nice to see it during smallie water levels.

 

Thanks John for the PM and tips. It made the clouser sit nice and level.

 

I will have to reflect, revise and return to this area.

 

If we get a warm weekend, The old Pensobscot might get pulled out of the garage and back on the water.

 

Thanks for such a detailed conversation on this. Even if I didn't catch a fish, I felt much more confident chasing cold water bronzbacks.

[Jonn Graham]

sounds like you found some cool spots. Maybe they just were not biting when you were there. I have found that sometimes hitting the same wintering area twice in one day will allow for better fishing. Ofen, the first time you fish it you may blank, but come back in a few hours and you will not believe it is the same area you had fished.

[Norm M]

Manny

 

I would definitely return to those spots. Don't get locked into using just "coldwater" techniques, you'll find the fish don't all react positively to those particular triggers.